>>26529711
Nancy No-Chin: A scrawny little guy with what appeared to be a missing chin. He was quiet and out of the way, and he never really did much OOCly, so I can't comment too much on his real character. He played a Monk/Psionic Fist/Soul Fist variant who was basically the stereotypical zen, master-of-self, I-only-want-peace-but-will-kill-you guy of the party. The character was so bland, I don't evenremember anything else about him.

The Fish Face: She wasn't ugly, but she was bug-eyed and looked like she had silicone injections in her lips. Okay, she was pretty ugly, but she had the typical skinny bitch attitude like she was hot stuff. So, I couldn't help but superimpose a big carp over her every time I looked at her. It's probably for the best, because I was too distracted by this mental image to really pay attention to a lot of the stupid shit she said. she was at most times trying to drag politics or religion into debate where it was nonsequitor or a red herring altogether. Her character was an annoying as shit Wilder who was the typical "fiery tempered" Mary Sue. She geared up to be the nuke of the party. Also, it was a fucking Drow with trite, WASP ethics. Yeeeaaah...

The Only Decent Player (not me): A really big guy and not at all fun to look at, but he was mostly pleasant and seemed to know his stuff. He wanted to play a bard, but the GM convinced him to play something else through the same means he convinced me to not be a UMD focused rogue minmax or gtfo, and he ended up going for a Magus. It was kind of interesting because he played him like a tribal warrior-shaman whose tribe was in deep shit because of the developments in the more developed parts of the world and was attempting to save his people from being disturbed by the recent events. He was also really creative in combat. All in all, I think he was the only one who put real effort into the game.

>>26529727
That Faggot: This guy gives a bad name to faggots everywhere. He had no concept of personal space and no concept of "I'm not gay." Thankfully, he did have a concept of "If you touch me there again, I'm going to pummel you and file a sexual misconduct suit." I suppose I'd be flattered if it was a woman, but god damn, this guy was a fucking creeper. It didn't help that his character was what I called OOCly "The Date Rape Psion." Seriously, That Faggot would probably turn people homophobic if they'd never met a normal gay guy before.

Me: I was making a high charisma, Trapmaking/disabling and UMD focused rogue, but I was flatout told, in so many words, that I needed to make a minmaxed, powergamey character or I wasn't going to get to play. I took offence, so I made a Wizard, stereotypical in dress from the conical hat to the robes and tiny glasses. I wanted to give him a beard, but apparently in his setting, elves can't have facial hair, so I said his eyebrows grew down to his belt. It was an old fossil of an elf from back when magic was the milk and honey of the world and was going to recruit anyone he saw with even a modicrum of magical talent in an ill-advised attempt to save the practice of magic in a world of pervasive psionics by showing up on random people's doorsteps, telling their children that they were wizards, and spiriting them a way to a permanent greater demiplane with a castle where his cohort would teach them magic. If you get the joke, you're smarter than most of this group. Most of my feats were item creation ones so that I could have the wands and staves that I loved to have in my arsenal.

>>26529745
It wasn't a good start. I was already being an asshat because I got sand in my cunt over being told to minmax or gtfo, and Fish-face and That Faggot were annoying as fuck too, which was adding to my ire.

We finally start the session. We congeal off the walls of a high-end tavern in some urban area. some plot, and then we go wandering about, I spellcraft and detect magic every apprentice-aged kid I see and try to discretely determine if they have any talent. The GM blocks this at every turn for understandable reasons; I mean, it would derail things. Yet, at the same time the Date Rape Psion was dragging NPCs off all the time and attempting to describe all the terrible things he was doing to them. I told him to knock it off more than the GM did, and the GM sent me a few warning glances about it, but seriously, I don't need to hear about the Date Rape Psion unleashing all his fetishes on villagers. The Date Rape Psion also harrassed my character ICly, but I slapped a Protection from Evil on myself and he couldn't physically touch me for a while. I ended up making it permenant later because I knew the little fucker was counting down for the spell to expire so he could get on with touching my wizard inappropriately. Thankfully I packed a lot of diamond dust with me for some of my more powerful magic and so I could see what I could do with the GM's very generous permenancy house rules.

>>26529754
The "Fiery Tempered" Wilder Sue gave my character flak, calling him a pedophile ICly with great vindication as if it was the scummiest act imaginable, which was funny coming from a Drow. Granted, I suppose some of his stuff with scouting students could appear a bit like that, but dear, sweet Jesus, why target me and not the Psion who was sneaking off to rape NPCs whenever we were pausing to investigate something? The Wilder continued to lambast me for reasons I didn't really understand, with which I retaliated with a long winded pontification about how magic was dying and why it needed to be passed on. This had a lot of old-man ramblings about the good ol' days with lots of Patridge Farms references and I ate up a lot of time with that. Although, I did stop to occationally note that my character was indeed going about his business and proceeding towards the obvious goal of the current plot point.

It was about a minute into my good ol'days spiel before she started to talk over me with this weird line of dialogue. It was like she was projecting her hate for an ex onto my wizard and DARVO-ing the fuck out of him, which got confusing fast, so I used Message cantrip to talk in her ear about the good ol' days and leave the general area so my wizard would be out of earshot. Yeah, I know message establishes a two-way conversation, but I argued that because magic was so obscure now, like someone being fluent in Esperanto in Asia, that she wouldn't know how without a spellcraft or knowledge arcana check of some kind. Fortunately, she didn't have either trained and I got to be petty and talk about the good ol' days without having to listen to her ICly or- thanks to the GM- OOCly either. I only kept it up for a couple minutes and went back to the plot right aftewards.

>>26529767
The Wilder tried to PK me about ten minutes later when I rejoined the group after a brief detour. Apparently she was incensed at the fact that I found a cheap way to make it so that I didn't have to listen to her but could prattle on like the old man my character was. Luckily, I hadn't been flatfooted, having good sight of her, and won the initiativen. So, I beat her stupidly high spell resistance and turned her into a newt, because my wizard was all about the classics. One mage hand later, and I held her newtified character in my hand and decided that I'd talk about about why the Newt Baleful Polymorph was such a classic. The Date Rape Psion and the Monk Psion both decided to defend her character and demanded that I release her at once. Not wanting everything to devolve into fighting, I played it off as if my Wizard thought that they wanted her released into their custody and told them that they looked like they could "handle any of the kid's hissy fits." He handed her over and began to walk off, "forgetting" to undo the effect. They cleared their throats and got his attention about it, and I told them that they could hire a court mage to dispell it and they reminded me that mages were almost extinct. Oh! I then dispelled the baleful polymorph and went "silly me" and moved on. I think they were all pretty upset save the Magus who was being all sage and witch-doctor like in the background of all this and trying to keep the peace like a good guy..

>>26529781
Fish-Face, No-Chin, and That Faggot were clearly plotting since they'd take breaks to go off and huddle and were passing notes during the session in what they probably thought was a discreet manner. Maybe it's my trained eye for catching students texting, but they were really obvious about it. I figured they were going to gang up on me at some point, so I just kept a scroll of plane shift in one hand in case I had to escape, figuring being a wizard would let me excuse just happening to have a scroll ready. Fortunately, whatever was going to happen was put off when what was apparently the BBEG showed up to cause havoc and monologue at us. We were told that his "awe inspiring feats of psionic power" were terrifying even to the likes of us blah blah blah, we're obviously not supposed to fight him because he's too powerful. I would later find out that he was some level 40 psion/some psionic prestige class. Apparently he was trying to turn psions against non-psions blahblahblah, okay, he's a psion-supremicist not!Magneto.

>>26529795
Fish-Face tries to get my wizard killed by the BBEG by attacking him and rolling bluff to make it look like it was me before cheesing it. No-chin and That Faggot soon follow. The Good Guy Landwhale stays for like a round before he gets out of there too after my wizard assuring him that he'd be fine and to go. I was only really worried about losing my gear since I had a cloning lab set up in my Demiplane and would just appear there with a couple negative levels and no items, not that the others knew that. Those dicks just wanted my character to die. The BBEG looks at me and asks who dared to attack him. I played the part of a senile old man picking up his scrolls and looking through them while failing to make a coherent statement. While doing this, I ask the GM for a planes check so that what I'm about to do isn't metagaming. My obscenely high planes roll let me know, in the GM's Words "Everything about the Plane of Force" which was the specific plane that I wanted to know about. I manage to get out a read magic in the meantime which the GM is nice enough to not make me roll init for, and I activate a scroll of Time Stop that I had retrieved in the confused old man act. I get lucky on the roll and I've got five rounds to do whatever in. So what do I do? I cast planar adaptation on myself, pull out a scroll of gate, and slide on over to a specific point in the Plane of force, the point that psions the biggest psionic connection is.

>>26529806
Because of the various books that the GM had informed me that he had been using, I knew on a meta level that Psions are all connected to the plane of force. If you do it right, you can go on an easter scavenger hung and sever a psion's ties to the plane which is a lot like forcefully making a cleric or paladin lose the favor of their god, all those abilities go bye-bye. Since the GM was so kind as to tell me that I knew everything about the plane of force, I thought I'd go and ruin the BBEG's day. Now, I only had three rounds left in my time stop, and I didn't really want to risk the BBEG figuring out what happened and being trapped with a level 40 psion on the plane of force, wizard or not. So, I got busy and cast gate, a gate to the point where the place between the negative energy plane and the quasielemental plane of void. I then take advantage of the GM's oh so generous permenancy house rules and dump 25k gold worth of diamond dust- out of about a hundred thousand that I had on my person- on making that gate permenant. Not wanting to be there when the chaos from that started up, I renewed my time stop and plane shifted to the material world and watched the unfolding chaos.

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>verbose story time
I'm going to take a preemptive break to get some popcorn

>>26529816

Thanks to my second casting of Time Stop, I had another two rounds to do as I will, so I cast an extended black tentacles and greater invisibility on myself. After that, I just spammed maximized empowered enervates from a staff until the fucker died. with psionics fizzling out of existence, he was a level 40 commoner. Thankfully, there are no saving throws versus enervation, so he died quickly and the GM had no plot because psionics didn't exist anymore, the plane of force was gone.

WHAT? No, that can't be! Retcon time.

The GM changes it to before I started casting enervates and then he got dramatic about the earth shaking from the wild things being thrown out willy nilly by every psion in the material plane, and I managed to cast psionic resistance on myself, a spell that the GM had made available as an analogue to spell resistance since psions were everywhere, and that helped me avoid some nasty stuff that was being tossed in my direction. Every Psion was apparently discharging every power point they had at random. Because I used plane shift to get back to the material realm. The BBEG apparently still had his psionics under full control, and so I was confronted with a monologue of doom with psionic chaos being thrown around in the midst of it for drama. I pull out another scroll of timestop (because I had an asston of the things because why not?) and then I cast planar adaptation on myself and immediately left for one of many private demiplanes I have without waiting for him to finish. The BBEG followed me through what I assumed was GM fiat. So I cop out and get a scroll of Greater Demiplane out of my handy haversack, a scroll because I don't have six hours to actually cast the spell, so I can add a new property to the demiplane we were standing in. I chose "nonpsionic."

>>26529823
The GM stared at me blankly. I said that one of the many things you can do to a demiplane is make it so that there's no magic in it. Since he provided so many magical things that could affect psionics like psionic resistance, detect psionics, and other things for the sake of the setting and left it open to other things, I said that it was only logical that I could do it with a demiplane. He vetoed it by saying that the psions' connection to the plane of force is inherently different from magic, so it a demiplane couldn't block it out... even though there's such a thing as an anti-psionics field, but whatever. I personally think it was the GM not wanting his terrible BBEG to turn into a level 40 commoner again, but that's just my opinion. Since the GM vetoed letting me negate psionics. In this plane, I had a bunch of constructs of mine crafting shit because you can totally do that if you give them a brain. Expensive, but awesome. WHis demipane had the fire dominant elemental trate, so my constructs that healed with fire damage and got obscene ammount of hp per round and already had a buttload of temphp on top of their normal max because this is where they lived, so I cast dimensional anchor on the BBEG and used my control over the constructs to just have them drop what they were doing and mob him.

Greater invisibility > an antidetection spell > spam maximized empowered enervations.

And that, is how I got kicked out of a pathfinder group first session.

>>26529754
>but I slapped a Protection from Evil on myself and he couldn't physically touch me for a while.
Okay, I chuckled.

>>26529830
>>26529823
ALRIGHT.
Well I admit, at least you had it thought the fuck out.
And you rid the story long enough not for me to be angry at you either.

Great story OP! You're a dick, but an entertaining one.

>>26529877
>>26529904
Glad I could entertain you guys.

The story's much more funny when you type it out rather than telling me in person. That's fucking awesome, you left some out when telling me you rat bastard.

You're an asshat and I never want to play with you or anyone else in that group.
But good story, was entertaining.

Well, that is EXACTLY what you get if you prepare an epic level campaign and not take epic level casters into account.

Meh. I'm indifferent to the whole thing. After 4 different groups of people, I despise the whole "I'm going to be petty and make things difficult for you IC'ly for no reason" from other players. Had I been in your shoes? I probably would have been more petty, maybe pulling the other characters into the demiplane as well, then gtfo'ing out. I would figure at about the time that the drow is trying to cause your character to die, then it's time to go out with a bang, yeah?

>>26530221
To be honest, I'm surprised he just threw me out without bothering to even rocks fall me first.

What degree on the henderson scale do you anons think this is?

How did the other players react to these events?

I'm unfamiliar with the Henderson scale but he already tried to rocks fall you. Twice.
The first time came from retconning becoming a level 40 commoner. If he was going to retcon that, he should've retcon you having also -taken- the action and left you a stuttering old man before Magneto. He didn't, so he played it as if you'd just failed to attack him directly.
His next Rocks Fall was pursuit. Which ended him in a demiplane that miraculously couldn't shut out psionics because the DM said so. So it ended in being turned into Psionic Green by a bunch of constructicons.

at that point he may as well have just said 'giant shoehorns fall, you die'. But there's no satisfaction in that.

>>26530345
The psions were screaming bullshit over it because they got turned into commoners and the monk/psion got turned into a monk 6 / commoner 14 with good BaB. Since they had run far away from where I was, they couldn't really do anything to me even if they somehow avoided getting magicked to death. That Faggot and Fish Face basically threw temper fits until the GM retconned everything and continued to do so until the point where I got thrown out. It was like playing a game with ten year olds and watching their parent change the rules to placate them.

>>26530187
What are you talking about? That level of creativity, I'd love for him and the Only Decent player to be in any game I ran. Shit, making all psionics null and void just to kill what amounts to a god? I'd applaud, and raise him to Divine 0.

>>26530317

If the Kill all Psionics maneuvre had worked, that would wreck not just the game but the universe entirely, thus scoring 2 full Hendersons. As is, I'd give it anywhere from .75 to 1.25.

>>26530443
So I scored two full hendersons and forced the GM to completely change the universe and then I scored another henderson ranging for .75 to 1.25 on the second universe where the maneuver didn't work? Hot damn.

I'm strangely proud of this.

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/The_Henderson_Scale_of_Plot_Derailment

The Henderson Scale for those who aren't familiar with it.

>>26530475
I would say you scored more than 2 Hendersons, if only for killing a god, not once, not twice, but 3 fucking times.

>>26530475
The sad part is that if the GM had been even mildly inventive, he could have shut you down within the bounds of the plot. Magic was supposed to be dying, right? So all this epic-level magic should have been guttering and failing left and right.

>>26530540
Mmm, my bad. Falling out of use, not failing. Still.

>>26530551
I know, but like I said, he was pretty hamfisted. Never played with him before or since so I can't really comment on his overall style.

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>>26529745
> showing up on random people's doorsteps, telling their children that they were wizards, and spiriting them a way to a permanent greater demiplane with a castle where his cohort would teach them magic
50 points to Gryffindor!

I mean, he TOLD you to be a minmaxed hooligan, so, thats what he got

Great story, OP. You're a dick. But I like your style.

Guys, give me a sec while I piece together these screencaps, so this can be preserved.

This was a pretty cool story.

If you were in my group I would invite you back again.
I love it when players actively seek to interact with the world.

Moral of the story: don't tell players to powergame unless you really, really want them powergame.

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>>26530922
And here it is.

I have to say that I immensely enjoyed your character. The idea of an old wizard who's just too experienced/powerful/grumpy to fall for the tricks that special snowflake type characters use sounds like it would be a fun way to counter those kinds of characters.

>>26531039
>not unspoilering spoilered parts for the pic
why

But thank you.

>>26531049
*insert foot in mouth*

Knew I was forgetting something... Dangit.

>>26531039
>>26531049
>>26531080
It's okay! I fixed it!

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>>26531080
>*insert foot in mouth*

>>26531153
Care to share the fix with the class?

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>>26531039
>>26531049
>>26531080
>>26531153
Tried to abort when I realized I forgot the pic... didn't work out.

The Date Rape Psion sounds like the most interesting character in the game.

OP you sound rather bland and annoying.

>>26531228
Thanks for saving that.

>>26531320
You're welcome OP. As much of a jerk move it was, it was definitely entertaining.

>>26531280
Yeah, in the way that Jeffery Dahmer was interesting. I wouldn't have minded if he faded to black whenever he was going to rape someone or something, but he insisted on spouting his fetishes to the entire party and so it wasn't pleasant to listen too.

I'm feeding a troll, aren't I?

>>26531330
Glad to be of service.

Bravo.
10/10 for optimisation, putting up with the fellow players of emotional stuntedness, and for managing to destroy the entire universe twice.
Psionics are taking over.
Well, Ill just destroy their entire plane.
Thats kinda like wanting to destroy the plane of dreams after having a nightmare, or killing every single god/ putting the outlands effect onto the multiverse after the clerics get uppity

>>26531343
Sorry, I would probably have just lel'd and added fuel to the fire.

>>26531352
The funny thing is, this probably isn't even close to the worst stuff a 20th level wizard could do if he wanted to.

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>>26531228
Just noticed that white bar on the side and it was infuriating me. ONE LAST FIX!

>>26530500

Well, if he hadn't kicked you out, it might have gone above 2 Hendersons. You are to be congratulated.

>>26531420
You have my interest. Please, elaborate on these glorious horrors of optimisation

>>26531420
>>26531470
Just be glad it wasn't a 21st level wizard. Once you hit epic spellcasting you can summon infinite Solars to do your bidding and turn the entire planet into Unicron.

I once caused a 1.5 on the henderson scale by ordering orbital bombardment of 4 eldars, killing everyone

>>26531431
Do you have a version in Yotsuba B?

>>26532183
Why do you want your eyes to bleed?

>>26532194
Bright text on dark backgrounds is worse.

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Capped for prosperity, but it looks like I've been beaten to the punch.

O well.

This was definitely 1.25 Hendersons. The DM was at that specific level of fed up and infuriated, specifically because you completely shut him down while remaining within the established bounds of the rules.
That he changed the rules in unfair ways to avoid it is inconsequential.


Which reminds me of the time I was in a game where someone else managed to inadvertently pull 1.75 Hendersons by spiking the glass, plot level magic item on the ground like a football while also in an artifact induced anti-magic field.

The DM just kinda looked at us in horror before asking the guy to confirm several times. He then took several minutes to break to figure out what happened due to the nature of that particular plot-level magic item breaking, and came back laughing hysterically.
Ultimately it was determined to be the magical equivalent of a nuke, and completely decimated everything in a 25-mile radius (within which was one of the largest and most powerful castles in the entire world housing the most powerful military), and seriously affected everything in a much larger radius.
The entire setting had to be either retconned or completely changed just to fit the new political situation. And none of that was even beginning to account for the magical rift that formed at ground zero which began spewing powerful abominations at an ungodly rate.

Needless to say it was a TPK. But we chose to play our next party coming out from the rift bewildered as to why their teleport spells had all simultaneously failed despite going to and coming from different locations.

>>26532282
>spiking a glass, plot level magic item to the ground like a football
I am so doing this.

>>26532282
I disagree. He broke the campaign so hard that it had to be retconned three times before they finally just threw him out. It's gotta be more than just 1.25

To be honest the GM shouldn't have kicked you out you played that all correctly, he should have given you some sort of minor victory and had the BBEG return for revenge in some way better prepared for such a talented wizard. He was too adamant in his story and because of that when you find a loop hole he's fucked.

>>26532583
Yeah, I would have accepted him having the BBEG take in a portion of the plane of force or some other plot device and returned for later, but apparently he just didn't want me to land any hits at all.

It would have been a neat plot had he been "the last psion" and trying to bring psionics back the way my wizard was trying to revive magic.

>>26532688
I have to say
Bravo Sir
and you are a fellow teacher at that

>>26532712
I try.

>>26532688
I would have time with him somehow escaping or surviving. Making it seem like he's been defeated. Have you guys side quest on dismantling his followers and have him return out of the blue. In a realm becoming filled with Psions at such an alarming rate you'd think there would be some unatural source that he could use or some shit. Always gotta be able and willing to stop a train and adjust its course before it derails.

>>26532773
Now that would have been fun and interesting... had the party not been total dicks, but hey, you can't have the perfect party every game.

OP, what you did was not being a That Guy at all. I would be happy to GM for someone like you. You were told to minmax and that's what you did I presume.

>>26532514
It's not actually breaking the campaign if it's broken to begin with, it's just kindly demonstrating the broken things.

As much as I want to, I can't get mad at your rambling notDumbledore elf. Great story.

>>26532243

Thanks man, I prefer Yotsuba B myself so I'll save your version.

>>26532282
That sounds an awful lot like something that happened in my campaign.

Except the plot item was a sword and rather than breaking it, they used it to hit another plot item.

>"...Uh, okay, are you sure? You're not 100% on what that magical seal is holding back, but you're pretty sure it's a whole fuckton of negative energy"
>Yes, I'm sure.
>"I mean like a whole lot of magical energy. Hell of a lot."
>Yes, I am sure.
>"I don't think I'm getting across just how much negative ener-"
>Just do it already, goddamnit
>"Okay, let me work out what happens here..."

10 minutes of stalling later.

>"You hit the seal with the sword, causing it to break and release an unrestrained pulse of negative energy roughly equivalent to a necromantic nuke . 99% of the population is now zombies, and magic that utilises positive energy has been permanently disrupted. The astral pathways used by teleportation spells have been torn asunder and opened to horrors from beyond the veil, causing many, many wizards to be devoured mid-teleport. The BBEG, his lieutenant, and the good guy who is funding your group all teleport into the room at once and ask what the fuck you just did. Roll fortitude and will to not have your soul torn out."
>Fuck you DM
>"This is the future you chose."

this is why I dislike epic level games.

>>26533420
Everyone does. I didn't know it would be epic level until I got there and then I didn't want to have wasted a trip and thirty bucks worth of food and gas. :S

>>26533420
Funny thing is that the party wasn't even epic level yet.

>>26533475
Just level 20. Not quite there yet.

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so today one of my players used thee dragonborn firebreath power inside a library stacked to the ceiling with spellscrolls

and then i dug out the arcane disaster table to see exactly how bad the tpk was........

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>>26533531
Do tell

>>26533531
>>26533381
>>26532282

Sounds like you guys forgot rules #1, #2 and #3.

1 - Players do stupid things
2 - Players do really stupid things
3 - Do not assume that your players will not do really, really stupid things.

>>26533576
aka Why Murphy's Law Means Save The World Stories Are A Really, Really Bad Idea

>>26533576
4 - As the proximity to important plot artifacts increases, the possibility of a player doing a stupid thing approaches 1

>>26533531
The arcane disaster table? You wouldn't happen to have a copy of that table handy, would you? I need it because reasons.

>>26533671
gimme a sec

>>26533671
i have an old printout dont have a digital copy or scanner so...
note that this is paraphrased


1.planar rift opens
2.arch demon summoned
3.area in a 1 mile radius is a magical deadzone
4.surrounding area turned to stone
5.all living things in 1 mile radius make a save vs death

cont...

Bam

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/That_Guy_Destroys_All_Psions

>>26532282
>This was definitely 1.25 Hendersons. The DM was at that specific level of fed up and infuriated, specifically because you completely shut him down while remaining within the established bounds of the rules.
>That he changed the rules in unfair ways to avoid it is inconsequential.


I disagree. OP probably got a good 4-5 full Hendersons out of this story.

For example, 2 Hendersons: The action undertaken has decimated the plot and universe so utterly that the entire game has to be scrapped, retconned, posted about on /tg/.

I note 'retconned'. The GM had to do that TWICE. So there is four alone.

Functionally OP scrapped the campaign several times in one game session. Usually that only happens one time...

>>26534451
Not to mention that he basically enervated him to negative levels. Doesn't that make it so that you can't be revived?

>>26534490
In 3.5, you rise as a wight from dying to negative levels.

In PF, you can't be raised, but it says "permanent negative levels", which would seem to imply that Enervation wouldn't count.

>>26534689
Oh right. he'd need to cast an extended enervation for them to become permanent... something tells me OP would have nuked the corpse with them had he not been retconned so many times.

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>>26533576
>>26533669
"Congratulations, the War of the Last Alliance is over. As the Ring melts in the fires of M-"
"Whoa, hold on. I never said I threw it in."
"...what? But it's the only thing between you and the complete destruction of Sauron. Killing him was the entire point of this campaign."
"We already routed the last of the orcs and destroyed his body. There's no way we could just throw away an artifact this powerful when my character could use it to build a second Númenor."
"Elrond notices your hesitation and commands you to destroy the Ring."
"Oh please, I could kick his ass even if he wasn't unarmed. I take the ring and leave."
"Fine. You return home with the ring and begin restoring your kingdom. But one day you're out on the road and -" [roll] "- oh hey, it's a battalion of orcs coming to reclaim their master's soul. What are the odds."
"Bullshit. Let me see those dice."
"The orcs murder Isildur and his guards; nobody knows what happened to the Ring. Middle-Earth has learned a lesson in the arrogance of Men, and I've learned a few things about how to build DMPCs in the next campaign."

>>26534801
>use it to build a second Númenor
If that was Isildur's actual motivation, how was he going to do it using the One Ring?
How?

>>26534801
The One Ring was an intelligent Ring of Invisibility that may or may not have been Sauron's phylactery. How's that going to do anything?

Also, that's why I prefer the image of Sauron being a really wily rogue rather than the big spiky thing in the movies. I mean, come on.

>>26534916
I see him as a fuckhueg and powerful wizard of a sort.

>>26534884
It enhances the wearer's abilities, so he presumably would've done the same things as he would without the Ring except that he'd be better at it. There doesn't seem to be much reason for him to have wanted to keep it (aside from the corruption thing).

>>26534977
Arcane Trickster or Prestige Bard was my interpretation.

>>26534979
Intelligent items with a decent ego can easily take control of a wearer and warp their minds.

They can also bestow some really annoying negative levels on their wearers if they don't like them.

>>26531656
>Once you hit epic spellcasting you can summon infinite Solars to do your bidding and turn the entire planet into Unicron.
Welp, there's my next villain.

>>26534916
He was a wily rogue, he just stole the body of a golem before the fight, and then went through the armies like cheap mexican through your bowels.

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>>26535068
>MFW, Sauron is Hassan.

>>26535308
Hassan Ibn Shapur?

>>26535330
You bet your sweet tits.

Wait. Waitwaitwait. You're telling me you caused Three counts of 2 full Hendersons in this game? In one session?

>>26535847
I don't think OP caused THREE 2 Full Hendersons. The last one was probably only a 1.

>>26535847
>>26536629
I think it's about 3-5 hendersons, due to retconning.

>>26537079
That's what I'd put it at, too.

>>26537079
3 Hendersons, 2 Schrödinger's Hendersons

>3.5/Pathfinder
>Level 20
>DM flat-out ORDERS you to "make a minmaxed, powergamey character", to the point where he shoots down a less powerful character idea
>Allows the Wizard class as-is with no nerfs (and even a homebrew buff)

Not saying you weren't still being That Guy, but any smart DM should've seen the flaw in this plan from a mile away. He asked you to make a broken character...so you did. If I had to guess I'd say he wasn't too experienced and thus wasn't fully aware of what minmaxed Wizards in 3.5/PF were capable of.

I just gotta say, OP, I love your character. The part where you just got fed up with that bitch and used magic to rattle on in her ears while you walk away made me smile.

Grumpy old wozards are fun when they're played right.

And honestly, I'm not sure you did anything wrong here, aside from getting fed up and using what you had available to crush the plot into a fine powder. You did it all within the rules, too.

Nice show, grumpy wizard.

>>26537335
I'm pretty sure OP is the lesser evil in all of this. He may be That Guy, but he's a pretty mild one, at least by comparison.

>>26533381
Had a player cast arcane sight while invisible, 10 feet away from a set of 10 archliches attempting to destroy the artifact that contained all magic on the prime material plane. He fried. Not even "Are You Sure" dissuaded him.

>>26537152
What in god's good graces is a Schrödinger's Henderson? Those two names together make my testicles shrivel in pure terror.

>>26537079
>>26537097
>>26537152
>>26537338
Thanks for the love, guys. I'm glad my anecdote could provide such entertainment.

>>26538226
Schrödinger's name is frequently associated with quantum physics, so he's probably referring to the two retcons that happened while I was in the game.

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>>26530712
Fuck you old man why won't you let us win the cup?

>>26538391
Because you are pompous, selfish, destructive little brats and the only reason you're in this school is because your rich parents pay us in SOLID FUCKING GOLD.

>>26538682
And sometimes silver, for scholarship students. Also, you're a whiny bitch.

>>26538682
Seriously, name on good thing to come out of Slytherin.

>>26538785
Voldemort did nothing wrong

>>26538807
I disagree there, you see unlike Hitler, Voldemort did nothing right.

>>26538856
One got beat by a man with polio, the other by a baby. Neither come out very well, IMO.

>>26538888
Voldemort giver a bad name to Liches and quasiliches everywhere.

>>26538785
>>26538807

To be fair, the deck is kind of stacked badly in Hogwarts.

You can either be a Coolguy Jock, a Magical Racist, a huge nerd or some asshole called Hufflepuff.

>>26538898
>implying Cedric Diggory wasn't Coolguy Jock

Gryffindor is Animal House, full of worthless dropouts who get away with it because the authors on their side.

>>26538898
I'd take huge nerd, personally.

OP, you deserve a medal.

http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/26529711/

Archived for posterity.

Honestly OP, if it falls within This Guy-ism to provoke the fuck out of a bad DM (which the Henderson Scale link seems to suggest), then it would be This Guy ism to screw with bad players as well, making you a This Guy moreso than a That Guy IMO.

11/10 would invite to a game.

OP, if you didn't at least say before you were kicked out "YOU TOLD ME TO OPTIMISE, SO I DID!" I'm very disappointed in you.

>>26538785

... The gold they pay to keep their kids in Hogwarts? Also, how on earth did no-one there notice that the house affiliations tend to run in families? Seriously, it's almost like magical apartheid or something.

>>26541139
Could probably play the nature vs. nurture card here. The kids in Slytherin are racist fucks because their parents are racist fucks, and THEIR parents were racist fucks, and so on and so forth for a long damn time.

>Seriously, it's almost like magical apartheid or something.
Right along with keeping 'magic' and 'non-magic' very far apart.

When you get down to it, the Harry Potter universe isn't such a fanciful and wondrous place. You've got a bunch of crazy fucks with killing spells, racism and speciesism far as the eye can see, the 'good guys' often withhold information (and were willing to leave their chosen one with outright ABUSIVE people) and there's only about three types of jobs in the magical world, so that sucks, too.

>>26541202
>The kids in Slytherin are racist fucks because their parents are racist fucks, and THEIR parents were racist fucks, and so on and so forth for a long damn time.

That doesn't really explain the other houses though, which have multiple generations of the same family as members, e.g. the Potters, and I think the Weasleys too.

>When you get down to it, the Harry Potter universe isn't such a fanciful and wondrous place.

True. That said, other than spell and potion ingredients, there isn't much call for money outside of luxury goods due to being able to magic up food (which could fix world hunger if the wizards didn't have a huge boner about secrecy). Plus I'm convinced that, for the most part, long term exposure to magic destroys the logical parts of the brain, which is why wizards have a hard time understanding Muggle technology and why there would be a need to sort the smart kids into one group: they need enough people with fully functioning brains to actually keep wizard society running.

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>>26529830
>And that, is how I got kicked out of a pathfinder group first session.

>>26541280
>they need enough people with fully functioning brains to actually keep wizard society running.
Give it time and one of those Ravenclaw kids will figure this out. And unlike Voldemort, they'll actually win.

Is it any wonder Dumbledore bit it? His plan in the first book basically amounted to "Let's have really shitty security and let the paranoid trio of tweens go stop the guy breaking in to steal an IMMORTALITY INDUCING OBJECT. How are the kids going to do this? Why, one of them is going to touch the professor, of course! ...Which assumes a lot of things, such as the kids actually getting through the security (they did get hung up on that plant, as I recall, and Ron got a concussion by pulling a gambit) and didn't get just get killed or incapacitated on sight by a man willing to break all manner of laws and who has the audacity to steal a powerful magical item out from under DUMBLEDORE'S NOSE within Dumbledore's very own school...

...I think I like OP's rendition better, frankly.

>>26538785
The Half-blood Prince

>>26537335
Honestly, in a situation like this, with a party like that

Being That Guy and pulling a henderson is entirely acceptable.

OP should've checked with the DM about campaign specifics before driving there though.

>>26541339
>Give it time and one of those Ravenclaw kids will figure this out. And unlike Voldemort, they'll actually win.

I kinda want to see this now, except I know they'll make the Ravenclaw into the villain of the whole thing because apparently super-smart people are evil by default.

>>26541339
Dumbledore is the most evil, manipulative motherfucker in harry potter.

He's not stupid, he knows full well what is going on and the consequences of it all. He's manipulating the entire school, setting himself up as the nicest goody two shoes of all time. He's directly responsible for Voldemort being a thing.

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>>26534916
>rather than the big spiky thing in the movies
He looks quite nice in his god-form as not seen in the movies. They filmed and made scenes where aragorn and Sauron duel and at the beginning of it, Sauron appears in front of Aragorn in pure white/silvery god-form. You might find youtube videos of it.

>>26541489
Where as I kind of want to run (or play in) a game that amounts to "Ravenclaw puts their heads together and fixes all the stupid shit."

Just... all the actual intelligent people in the setting working together to fix the flaws in the system, bring the wizard society out of cultural and technological stasis and actually accomplish something lasting.

They'll have a lot of opposition, to be sure, but that's why it would make a good campaign. You'd have situations like Hermione trying to free the house elves... but they'll do it in a way that ISN'T a ridiculous half-baked scheme.

Cultural Reform: Hogwarts Edition!

>>26541551
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IqKt_h0EPuU

Some footage here

>Having the BBEG face the players before it's the time to face the BBEG
>Fucking with a 20th level wizard
They asked for it.

>>26541554

If it were run as an RPG then yes you could quite easily be the good guys of the whole thing, but in any other medium, expect them to be the villains. Like I said, people can't seem to accept super-smart people as anything but evil, especially in media.

>>26541889
Because most people are fucking stupid.

>>26533671
Seconding. Google turns up nothing.

Ok its me guys .
Or aka "that bro guy who never played , wants to , and doesnt understand all the small things about etiquette"

So i have a question about OP.
What did he do to make him an asshat ?

This is what i understood from the story:

>GM likes psions
>OP wants to be a wizard ( one of the few remaining )
>His party is full of fags
>Bitchfit ensues as wilder doesnt like OP for some reason.
>OP outsmarts wilder
>Homosex guy is angry because OP wont let him fuck his ass
>They get butthurt that OP outsmarted wilder who more or less started this
>All gang up on OP
>GM doesnt do anything about it , no Karma , no revocing etc.
>They set him up for him to be killed by the BBEG
>OP outsmarts everyone
>Suddenly everyone bitches that "whaaaa mommy that kid in the sandbox didnt let me kick him in the nuts and instead kicked me in the nuts"

So .. yeah , what did OP do bad ?

>>26542932
I think it's because he could've left the table without showing that he could ruin the whole thing or whatever.

>>26543074
Hrmm...

>This is a story that I'm not proud of where I lose my temper and utterly wreck a game, but I think it's a share-worthy story nontheless.

>>26533381
Damn. I can't help but like how grimdark it becomes.

>>26541025
I did, but I thought the "and that how I got kicked out..." was a better end point... Also I threw in a "Are you not satisfied?!" for the lulz
>>26542932
I'd call myself a "That Guy" because I pissed all over the game before I left. Granted, the other players and even the GM to an extent were "That Guys" too.

Old Man Henderson was a "That Guy" but we love him because he was the lesser of two evils and took out the GM with the power of his Chaotic Lulz techniques. Whether or not he's such a Ant-Hero That Guy he's propelled into This Guy territory is up for debate. Does being an Anti-That Guy make you This Guy? That's a complicated matter of opinion.

>>26529711
You're a magnificent arsehole, OP.

Fantastic creativity though.

>>26543853
Being a That guy isn't solely about ruining the game, it also encompasses social bad behavious and general obnoxiousness. One box to tick is also not knowing the game or not focusing to it. Also as I said yesterday in this thread, you cannot break what's already broken.

>>26541489
Kinda similar, it's a good read:

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/5782108/1/Harry-Potter-and-the-Methods-of-Rationality

>>26545016
You know, I used to like that until I discovered Less Wrong are basically AI cultists.

>>26541280
I thought that wizards in Harry Potter couldn't conjure food?

>>26543074
But that would be bad. Let me explain something.
The people who benefit from showing mercy and leaving wrongs unpunished are the wrongdoers. Meanwhile, punishing the wrongdoers rewards the victims. Who would you rather support, the people doing bad things or their victims?

>>26545124
It does get a little weird later on, but I recommend it to everyone, at least up to Crabe + Goyles introduction

>>26545016
What did you think about the most recent arcs?

>>26535308

Your face did nothing of the sort.

Guys... doesn't this qualify OP for raising to divine rank 0?

>>26549535
If he mentioned this to enough people, the new worshipers could bump him up a couple of ranks too

>>26549620
I propose a church to this glorious madman. What shall we call this new organization?

>>26549703
I'll bite. What do you think this glorious leader would command of us.

>>26545177

I'm pretty sure Mrs Weasley does it on occasion, though I might be remembering it wrong. Though if they can't, it does raise the issue of where wizards are getting their food from if they avoid Muggle shops. Also, the point about them being able to fix a whole bunch of Muggle world problems still stands without the food conjuring.

Okay, so we know he was level 20 when he killed the BBEG, right? And he did it by himself. Since the BBEG was level 40, that means he got somewhere in the neighborhood of 3,200,000 xp for that fight. So, the wizard is probably at least level 21 now. Should we give him more for having done it three times?

Now, a Divine 0 Level 21 Wizard Elf.

He destroyed all psionics and killed something roughly on par with a god thrice. He also promotes magic and margical learnings. One of his domains would obviously be Magic. The other?

>>26550008
DESTRUCTION.

>>26550008
eyebrows.

>>26550063
Agreed.

>>26533007
it breaks the campaign if the plot that the DM had envisioned for the entirety of the campaign went belly up. That's what OP did. The fact that the DM set up the world like that is pretty poor oversight on his part.

>>26549757
One of my friends tried the argument that "When the wizards saw muggles developing guns, they got scared and hid themselves."

My rebuttal:
>Wizards are egotistical, racist fucks.
>Wizards see that muggles develop weapons that can kill wizards.
>Wizards, instead of changing their attitude and being beneficial to muggles so they can form a symbiotic relationship, instead hide in a corner and whine.

I know it's more complicated than that, but I don't recall mention of ANY wizard actually giving enough of a fuck about muggles to try endearing him or herself to them.

>>26550008
>>26550063
I have to ask, if OP is reading: What is this glorious elf wizard's name? Because he deserves a spot in the pantheon of my next game.

>>26550554
Elsimore Bumblecane was what I put on the sheet, but during the campaign, his surname never came up, so you could always just call him Elsimore.

You folks want me to transfer his sheet to Myth-weavers or something?

>>26550554

That does make a degree of sense. A LOT of the witches and wizards in the HP books come off more as petulant teenagers more than anything else. It's part of the reason why I came up with the hypothesis that long term magic exposure destroys the logical parts of the brain (the other being the inability to understand Muggle technology, despite the existence of Muggle-born magic users).

>>26549703
The Holy order of That Henderson?
Captcha "Music ousru", clearly the (other) gods demand this man has his own soundtrack

>>26550697
Or it could be that exposure to magic causes the logic parts of the brain to never develop. After all, magic is inherently illogical, so living in a world without logic would cause it to warp your development.

>>26538896
this. so much this. Voldemort and WoW destroyed any chance of Lich awesomeness in the mainstream.

>>26550721
Ha! What soundtrack would be appropriate, hmm? That'd require some thought...

How did we go from a grumpy minmax wizard destroying a campaign thrice, to Harry Potter?

>>26550777
Probably something to do with >>26529745
> and was going to recruit anyone he saw with even a modicrum of magical talent in an ill-advised attempt to save the practice of magic in a world of pervasive psionics by showing up on random people's doorsteps, telling their children that they were wizards, and spiriting them a way to a permanent greater demiplane with a castle where his cohort would teach them magic. If you get the joke, you're smarter than most of this group. Most of my feats were item creation ones so that I could have the wands and staves that I loved to have in my arsenal.

>>26550620
>You folks want me to transfer his sheet to Myth-weavers or something?
I'm not sure what Myth-weaver is, but sure?

>>26550771
Sadly, I'm not one with a good ear for music, but maybe someone else good think of something? Something quiet, yet powerful, methinks

>>26550729

That works too. The fly in the ointment is the Muggle-born magic users though, because they end up like the rest of the wizards, despite spending their formative years outside the wizarding world. Surely someone like Hermione or a sufficiently intelligent Hufflepuff would start applying logical methods to magic and create innovations that other wizards had never considered. Well, either that or take over the world because they figured out how to MacGuyver a bunch of seemingly weak spells together to become ridiculously powerful. (It always strikes me as odd that a lot of magic users, in HP and elsewhere, use magic like a sledgehammer rather than being subtle with it. I mean you don't need to use Adava Kedavra to kill someone, why not just make them levitate upwards endlessly, for example?)

>>26550821
Myth-weavers is an online site for PBP games that's most commonly used for storing sheets

>>26550847
The logic centers of your brain don't fully develop until age 25, although they partially develop before that. Obviously, their later exposure to magic damages their development, hmm?

Of course, this is all headcanon and whatnot.

>>26550851
What he said. It's for sharing sheets the same way you use google drive to share word docs and what not.

>>26550899

Well of course, but it's better that than no canon. There are gaps to fill! Also, that's an interesting little fact, that would explain the reduced effect of Muggle-born kids, especially given that they then spend 7 years in magical boarding schools, essentially indoctrinating them.

>>26550851
Well in that case: Link please.

>>26551011
Use google, it's not hard

>>26551011
I'll toss it together. Might take like ten or fifteen minutes since I'll have to enter it manually.

>>26534916
>invisibility
If you read the books, the description is closer to leaving you halfway planeshifted into the Plane of Shadow, not mere invisibility.

>>26551342
Haven't read the LotR books since I was like 8, so I've forgotten some of the finer details.

>>26538785
Snape. BOOM done. Also fuck Ravenclaw too. Stuck up ass holes.

>>26551036
I meant TO THE SHEET HE UPLOADS, dumbass. How dense can you be?

>>26551649
Calm down son, you were responding to me after all. Is a simple misinterpretation so difficult to get over?

>>26551768
http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=630240

This is what Elsimore was like stat-wise. I got lazy and stopped writing down his equipment and spell list because it was long as fuck.

P.S. Transmutation Wizards are broken as shit.

>>26551834
Holy shit, OP. You weren't kidding when you said you were forced to minmax.

>>26551834
Jesus christ, how did you get the 50 intelligence again? Also which arcane school do you suggest? I'm playing my own, non min-maxed wizard in a friends campaign and I can't decide between Evocation or Illusion.

>>26551768
It is quite frustrating when my show of enthusiasm towards the OP is met with being told to use a site that only works for me about 2/3 of the time.

No, I have no idea why 1/3 of the time Google refuses to so much as load for me. Also, the speed at which people on this board jump to "Google it" is annoying. Again, more so when I'm not asking for the website, but a specific page on it that may take an hour of loading and skimming to find.

It's easy to get over, but the short lived anger is still intense.

>>26551834
I am now amazed at the idea of a >40 INT/DEX wizard.

And it's fucking ridiculous.

>>26551904
He had an Orange Prism which made his Caster level 21 (although he was still level 20) which let him craft a headband of +7 int, and by the time he hit level 20, this let him boost any stat by 14ish and grant +5 nat armor. He can also add +5 to two physical stats and shuffle those around each day. Plus those 5 +1s you get on the way to level 20 and reading a book of int +4 equals bam: 50 int. Although his base int was 36, he could make it so his int was 50 during combat for delicious DC and bonus spells.

The GM DID tell me to minmax...

Illusion is a good school. Evocation is bad for wizards IMO because nukes are more of a sorcerer thing.

Divination has the best class abilities because of dice rerolls and init bonuses, but the spells for that school are largely redundant or situational.

My personal favorite is Conjuration, especially the Creation or Infernal Binder subschools. Look at them on the srd if you're interested.

>>26552011
P.S. The +14 temp bonus comes from Transmutation school abilities if you use the enhancement subschool.

>>26552011
Yeah i've been really thinking about illusion, I would take conjuration but we have a summoner in our group and that's his deal

>>26552011
Oh, and +2 int for being middle aged (on the cusp of venerable)

>>26552040
Illusion is your next best choice then. The Shadow Subschool + Shadowcaster archetype + Umbral Court Agent prestige class is delicious although slightly broken.

Regular illusion school and the Mage of the Veil subschool also work well with the Veil Illusionist Prestige class.

__________________

If you go Illusion, you might want to take Student of Philosophy so you can use your int in place of char for bluff and diplo. Together with your illusions, you could be a formidable force and face.

>>26552094
That DOES sound pretty good, how did you get diplomacy as a class skill on your character if you don't mind me asking? And what can you say about liches? I recently got into pathfinder from 3.5 and I haven't heard very many good things about PF liches.

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>>26552094
Suppose I made a Pathfinder Wizard of the Transmutation/Enhancement school, with the Lost Tradition [Strength] feat from 3.5? How effective do you figure I'd be?

>>26552164
Student of philosophy lets you get one as a class skill. (If I'm wrong, I goofed, but I'm pretty sure it does).

Liches in PF are a lot simpler than 3.5. You just have to have Craft Wondrous Items and dump 120,000gp onto a phylactery and BAM, add lich template. Most GMs demand an alignment shift though because of the huge burst of negative energy or some other reason. It takes 240 in game days to craft, but if you start out with 120,000 gp to spend, go for it.

Bring a Greater Hat of Disguise though so you can polymorph yourself into a humanoid. You can still polymorph yourself even if you're immune to others' polymorphs.

>>26552257
The description for Student of Philosophy: You can use your Intelligence modifier in place of your Charisma modifier on Diplomacy checks to persuade others and on Bluff checks to convince others that a lie is true. (This trait does not affect Diplomacy checks to gather information or Bluff checks to feint in combat).
This leads me to believe it doesn't, I can't take a fourth trait as I already have three (one for backstory)

>>26552222
If you're level 20, and started out with high strength (say 16 str), then you could easily have 52 str (base 16 + physical enhancement 5 + enhance spell like ability 4 + perfection of self 10 + belt of strength 6 + manual of strength 5)

More if you totally just dumped all your gold into manuals of strength.

________________________

At lower levels, you could also be an effective punch wizard, especially if you took still spell early on, you could ignore spell failure. Or took the arcane armor training feats. Probably best for Eldritch Knight types.

Yep, this man is going to be a god in my next campaign.

Elsimore, god of magic, destruction and planning. Patron of wizards and teachers everywhere who are sick of this shit.

>>26552312
Oh, then I dun goofed. /fixes

>>26552357
Ha! I'm truly flattered. You'll have to let me know how that turns out. Post about it on teegee and archive it when all is said and done, yeah?

On Myth-weavers, my username is Melanolestes, so you could always send me a link there if you wouldn't mind. I'd hand out my email, but spambots would probably find it in a heartbeat.

>>26552353
Enhancement bonuses don't stack.

>>26552406
Oh yeah, wasn't thinking. You could do the rest with polymorph abilities though, like Monstrous Physique or Beast Shape.

>>26552357
I'm going to worship him, I don't give a fuck if he doesn't have a major presence in the campaign i'm in either.

>>26552434
So you could still get your str in the 40s, but it'd take some more preparation during or before combat.

>>26552465
If one was REALLY exploiting the system, whats the highest you can reasonably get your STR in Pathfinder? Besides Pun-Pun/etc.

>>26552549
You could easily get an eidolon up to 54 str. and therefore a synthesist could give that str to his summoner.

>>26552549
Assuming you somehow start with 20 STR

20 base + 4 from leveling + 6 enhancement from a belt + 5 inherent from five wishes or a book.
About 35, all told.

If you can find a sacred/profane bonus to strength somewhere, then add that to that total as well. The belt can be exchanged with any item you can somehow make using the crafting rules to get an even higher strength bonus.

>>26552591
>>26552622
Or be a synthesist, yes.

>>26552622
A transmutation wizard could grant a +1 per four wizard levels inherent to str and at level 8 grant a bonus equal to half their wizzy levels as a swift action a number of times per day equal to their class level. I think the latter is an enhancment bonus, but I'd need to check.

>>26552805
The transmutation bonuses are both enhancement bonuses, and so wouldn't stack.
Perfection of self would give a +10 bonus, so a +4 bonus for a short time over the belt.

>>26552866
Ah, right.

What level would you recommend I take Umbral Agent or Veiled Illusionist at?

>>26552906
Usually level 9 or 10 so you can get most of your school abilities. If you want to wait until 11, you can also cash in on that bonus feat and just go straight on the prestige class.

Umbral Agent can be taken a bit earlier if you don't need to have crazy shadowjump.

>>26552977
Thanks for all your help HynoJew, my last question is about opposed schools, i'm rolling with Enchantment and Necromancy, is this a bad idea?

>>26553059
Depends on what you want to do with your character... Necromancy is something I would avoid opposing because it has some of the best debuffs in the game. Enervation is a spell that you cannot save against and makes you immediately take on 1d4 negative levels and is what Elsimore spammed to turn that level 40 psion into a warm corpse. It's necromancy.

Enchantment is something I favor for skulduggery and playing social scenes on easy mode. It also complements illusions well so you can keep people from making will saves to disbelieve them... but that's your choice.

I usually have evocation as an opposed school because I don't use wizards to damage deal, but again that's just me.

>>26553175
Then again, if you're just going for an entirely illusion / mindfucker wizard, some good opposed schools would be evocation and necro, since that would sort of force you to rely entirely on deception and mindgames.

>>26553175
At level 5 I can take an arcane discovery that eliminates a school opposition, and level 5 is also when I get a bonus feat. Should I chimp out on divination and abjuration instead of necromancy and enchantment?

>>26553271
If you were going to do that, I'd recommend keeping abjuration when you get your oppositional research since, even though it's lists are small, it has a lot of really necessary things like dispell magic and whatnot, and level 1 and 2 abjuration isn't as useful as the higher level stuff, so you could go without for a few levels.

So, /tg/, should I just go ahead and use the powers of writefaggotry to craft Elsimore a profile as a minor deity?

>>26551904
Transmutation or Conjuration

>>26553345
yes.

>>26553345
yes.

>>26553345
Make sure his favored enemies are psionics.

>>26553345
Si!

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>>26553345

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>>26553345
Ooh yes please

>>26553366
>>26553375
>>26553396
>>26553407
>>26553426
>>26553449
Well after that overwhelming response, I suppose I should get to work. If this gets autosaged, keep an eye out for a new thread.

I'll just open up a word doc and get to work...

>>26553489
I'm going to worship him as the true god, don't you worry.

>>26553632
Once he gets enough followers, he'd be bumped up to true god eventually by the nature of divine ranks. I trust you'll do what you can to help. :D

>>26553678
He will have a burning hatred for psionics I hope?

>>26553721
They'll be his favored enemy.

>>26553271
Reread that.
You can't take Opposition Research until 10.

>>26552011
Man, your GM told you to min-max and had no idea how the system works.

No wonder it worked out so well for you.

>>26553834
Oh yeah? Well in that case I'd recommend against abjuration being opposed.

It'd be easier to recommend opposition if you would tell me what your intended role is or what it is you plan on doing.

>>26553869
The GM was asking for it.

>>26553869
I may have made some mistakes blatantly taking advantage here and there, but if you think Elsimore is broken, you should have seen the Psion and Wilder.

>>26553874
That's a really hard question, I want to be able to do a lot to help my team and be able to do things on my own, I already know the DM is allowing crafting time so I want to be able to make some magical stuff for the party, but I also want to be able to kill things, I probably can't have all of this anyway.

>>26553933
Wanting to do it all can get ugly. Although, not being good at dealing damage doesn't mean being bad in a fight. Evocation isn't the only combat school and is mostly just for those who want to play nuke, for example.

>>26553966
I realize I need a focus, what two schools don't really pick up until around level 10?

>>26553933
Look up a few wizard guides then, they're readily available.

Conjuration is immensely useful to specialize in, as they get some of the best control spells. Plus, Summon Monster is amazing.

>>26553981
Divination and Evocation.

>>26554060
You WILL need to find a scroll of Detect Magic or something if you go this route, but that's not terribly hard.
Otherwise, not a bad idea.

>>26554092
He can spend 12.5 gp on a scroll of detect magic so he can learn it and then it'd just suck up two 0 level spell slots to mem, but he'd be able to use it whenever.

>>26530317
Well wait, does it kill all Psionics or just depower them? The distinction is one that is between one decihitler and 4 dekahitlers.

>>26554135
It definitely depowers all of them, and because their brains are inherently tied to the plane of force, there's probably a few brainsplosions or mindwipes occurring as a byproduct. That sort of thing is mostly left to the GM though. After the first retcon in Elsimore's story, there was a lot of chaos so a lot of people probably died as a side effect as every psion went berserk.

>>26554101
So just spend 25 gold on detect magic and read magic scrolls? I can do that! I had no idea I could learn spells from scrolls.

>>26554170
All wizards know read magic, regardless of school opposition and can prepare it form memory.

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>>26533381
>this is the future you chose

my sides

>>26541280
You get into the House YOU want to be in. If your dad tells you about all the great times he had in Hufflepuff or Ravenclaw, you'll probably want that too.

As an update, I'm about halfway done with that Deity profile.

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>>26554377
Dare you enter his magical realm, /tg/?

>>26531228
are you using my capscript?

It feels so good to be useful sometimes.

>>26545124
>AI cultists
What?

Is there a limit to how many times I can take opposition research? I could eliminate both my opposed schools at level 10 because I get a bonus feat at that level.

>>26554735
There is not.

>>26554735
You might get that vetoed by a GM, but go for it. :D

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>>26554777

>>26554693
Yudowsky: I'm going to make a thought experiment and pretend that I am the ultimate AI, who's job is to convince you to let me out of this box!

Yeah. No.

Delivering Elsimore's divine profile.

ELSIMORE: Wizard, Teacher, Minor Deity

Elsimore is a minor deity favored by wrathful wizards and school teachers. He is known for being a patron of Arcane studies and heading extermination of psionic

creatures.

==Overview==

Titles: God of Magic, Destruction, and Planning
Patron of Wizards and Teachers
Patron of Those who are Sick of This Shit

Adjective: Elsimoran

Alignment: Lawful neutral

Portfolio: Magic, Schools, Engineering, Invention

Worshipers: Wizards, Mystic Theurges, Teachers, Summoners, Revolutionaries, Psion Hunters and Exterminators

Cleric Alignments
(LG) NG CG
(LN) (N) CN
(LE) NE CE

Domains: Magic, Destruction, Artifice, Liberation
Subdomains: Arcane, Toil, Revoltion

Favored Weapon: Rays

Favored Enemy: Psionics

Cont.

>>26554901
==Dogma==

Elsimore and his followers wish to expand the horizon of magic, fascilitate arcane pursuits whenever possible, fascilitate general education and schollarly pursuits,

and to eliminate forces of supernatural destruction, especial those with psionic or psi-like powers. Although Elsimoran dogma advocates for patient teaching and subtle

reprimand, Elsimore and his followers are known for wrath, especially in earth-shattering and paradigm shifting ways, usually towards Elsimoran goals. It is said to take divine intervention from a more powerful Deity to prevent Elsimoran revolutions

>>26554916
==Relationships to Other Religions==

Elsimore and Elsimorans are known to be decidedly neutral to most other deities and their followers, live and let live. There are, however, notable exceptions to this. Religions that discourage arcane magic, discourage inventiveness, or promote psionics are violently opposed.

>>26554928
==History==

Elsimore was once a mortal, a powerful and gifted wizard. As an elf that lived to see magic slowly fall out of use as psionic powers became widespread and abused, Elsimore became dedicated to preserving arcane magic. As corrupt psions began spreading havoc throughout his world, one enemy rose up to unite Psions in an attempt to wipe out nonpsions in a genocidal rampage. This entity was near godly in power, and Elsimore was forced to retaliate by unleashing the null zone upon the plane of force and depowering most if not all psions in his world, including that which conspired to exterminate nonpsions, but this power would not just lay down and die. Time and space itself conspired against Elsimore and forced him to face this godly entity thrice in combat before Elsimore triumphed. The consequences though expunged Elsimore from the material plane just as his glorious triumph made him into a Heroic God of magic and destruction.

As word of Elsimore's triumph and exploits spread, followers began to gravitate towards his worship and a dedicated following begun; Elsimore was no longer a mere Heroic Deity. Now, He is a patron to wizards, teachers, and revolutionaries big and small, fighting the good fight and promoting wizardry and education when not leading the extermination of troublesome psions. Some say that remaining psions are a sign of the dark entity that attempted to euthanize nonpsions returning and a new source of psionics emerging. Many followers of Elsimore take preventative measures to make sure this does not occur.

>>26554936
==School of Elsimore==

===Temples and Shrines===

The "temples" of Elsimore are schools of arcane magics and, to a lesser extent, divine magics. Nations with high levels of casters or magocracies are known to have a large scattering of the Schools of Elsimore. These schools seek out potential wizards, sorcerers, and other natural casters to teach. Mystic Theurges are not an uncommon sight within their walls or in the vicinity. These places are supported by student work and research serving the general public, wealthy alumni, and to a lesser extent, local governments. Despite their patron deity's known wrath and penchant for being worshipped by revolutionaries, the Schools are known to be publically neutral in all matters that do not directly concern the wellbeing of mages or magic, but mages being mages do at times meddle or participate in Quests for fame and fortune.

===Worshippers and Clergy===

Elsimore is primarily worshipped by mages, teachers of both magical and mundane topics, revolutionaries, and hunters of psions. Many of his worshipers hope to be guided in their pursuits with ancient wisdom and inspiration to act. The vast majority of Elsimore's clergy also know some arcane magics or work closely with those that do. Occassional Paladins that worship Elsimore are known to protect centers of knowledge and to fight against those that would surpress the right to the pursuit of knowledge and hunt down chaotic forces and evil or chaotic mages and psions that threaten the the Schools of Elsimore and Elsimoran values.

>>26554950
==Holy Texts==

Every book of knowledge is considered holy to Elsimore, especially spellbooks, but their is a covetted and legendary scripture that is said to be a copy of Elsimore's personal gririmore filled with personal theories, advanced spells, and secrets of magic beyond most's wildest dreams. Legend has it that copies of these texts are only bestowed upon Elsimore's most devout followers and the most wise and powerful mages.

>>26554959
What does /tg/ think?

>>26554901
Thanks, he's going straight into my setting

>>26554965
Let me read through this, is rays a weapon clerics can use?

>>26554977
Looking through the spell list. If they can't, then I suppose I should change it to "touch attacks" since clerics have plenty of those.

so what did they say when you got kicked out? any kind of attempts to reason it?

>>26554965
Love it

>>26555023
Oh, I tried to stay in because I was having fun and thought that the GM could salvage the game, but the basic consensus was "two out of three of the other players hate you and you're ruining my game. Get out."

But, eh, at least I have this awesome story.

>>26555027
>>26554975
Awesome, guys. I'm glad I could give this to you. Totally going to start up a few things where we can collect storytimes, writefaggotry and drawfaggotry with Elsimore-related events. I'll see what I can do...

>>26555060
I really like the places of worship being the schools, what would his holy symbol look like?

>>26555088
Oh, good question... A quill and scroll crossing one another and a encompassed by a vertical oval. Sound good?

>>26555118
That sounds a tad generic for a god of knowledge, but it could work... i'm trying to think of something but it's not working out so well.

>>26555140
That was just off of the top of my head... also I should add the Knowledge domain to his list. :B

____________________

A spiral staff encompassed by flames with the depiction of a scroll crossing it?

>>26555118
Maybe a scroll and a construct since those are the primary components that helped you achieve your godly feat?

>>26555199
A humanoid construct wreathed in fire (since the constructs were in a fire-aligned demiplane) holding a scroll?

>>26555242
Well, maybe the fire is a bit much. Might seem cliche.

>>26555253
What color did Elsimore mainly wear?

>>26555287
Usually I described him as wearing blue robes... when I wasn't coming up with garish and outlandish outfits.

>>26555306
A bronze Golem with blue veins holding a chalice in his hands, inside the chalice is a scroll of holy knowledge.

>>26555331
I think we have a winner.

>>26555306
Quick question. Can clerics use rays as anon asked earlier, and why can his clerics only be any lawful or true neutral, when one of his main worshippers is revolutionaries?

Well what is the symbol usually used for Psionics?

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>>26555341

>>26555355
Allow the choice of chaotic neutral then, and change Elsimore from a lawful neutral to a true neutral god

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>>26555356
I believe this is it

>>26555397
That with a circle and slash or an X

>>26555355
I think >>26555377 is the right idea. Especially since his main concerns are pursuit of knowledge.

I'll be editing the overview section in a bit to reflect the advised changes.

>>26538785
Not all Slytherins are terrible people. snape and slughorn, RAB

>>26555355
>>26555425
Oh, and where in the planes do his followers go upon death? like how if you worship Kord you go to the Heroic Domains of Ysgard

>>26555443
Maybe you become faculty with tenure at the Demiplane of Witchcraft and Wizardry?

>>26555425
Perhaps make Elsimore's favored weapon a book, an average book, that now does 1d4 Bludgeoning damage x3 crit?

>>26555443
Why, to his private, high magic domain where you can research to your hearts content... and have tenure.

>>26555467
You posted that just as I was writing, and I've got to say, great minds think alike... although the tenure bit something I didn't think of.

>>26555467
Hmm. Alright, barring Hypno's input I'll roll with that.

>>26534979
So THAT is why hobbits turn invisible while wearing it.

>>26555467
Perhaps in death you join the ranks of mages in Elsimore's plane? If you are lowly you kinda just chill, but if you were a great teacher or inventor you become a professor in The One True University. This university is linked to the Material Plane at wherever the head church of Elsimore is located. Since his churches are actually schools, this one would be the MIT of them, only the most apt would be accepted here. With the souls of all the past great mages as teachers this would be the pinnacle of magical learning in the world.

>>26555558
I like this. I hope you don't mind if I borrow from this.

>>26555558
Fuck it, going with this as it fits a location on my setting to a T

>>26555577
By all means, I am a wannabe author so if you have any specific part of Elsimore's lore fleshed out let me know. I'll change anything you like, he is your creation, I just want to help.

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>>26555620
If you WANT any part flesh out, fuck.

>>26555587
Be sure to post about it! I want to know anything that happens relating to him.

Also, starting a blog dedicated to Elsimore where I'll post his lore and any writefaggotry and drawfaggotry I or others willing to share produce. I'm going to document this shit.